Dear listeners, what if the thing that you have been working hardest to protect, your drive, your output, your um reputation for getting things done is also the thing quietly keeping you from knowing who you actually are. Most of us were I'd say never taught how to just be. We were taught how to perform. And somewhere along the way, we started confusing the two as well. If that sentence just landed somewhere in your chest, dear listeners, then stay with us. I'm your host, Avake, and this is the space where we have the conversations that most people are afraid to start. The honest ones, the necessary ones. And today I'm having a lovely guest with us. Please welcome Nicole Johnson. Welcome to the show.

Hello, thank you so much for having me. I'm glad to be here.

Amazing, amazing. Nicole, we are going somewhere that I think a lot of high achievers quietly need to go. We are talking about what happens when your identity gets uh wired from your productivity, when your worth feels like it uh lives inside your calendar, your results, your title, and what it actually takes to start separating who you are from what you do? This one is I would say for everyone who uh excelled at almost everything and still felt like something was missing. I definitely want to start with uh something like when you when you when you look back at your own journey, uh was there a moment, maybe a specific uh uh part in your life where you first noticed that something about how you were measuring yourself just didn't feel right anymore?

No, that's a great question. I think um I've been doing a lot of reflecting in the last year and a half, deep reflecting on my career journey uh after um navigating a deeply depleting uh burnout myself. And I I really think it was a culmination of many different moments over the last decade plus. Uh, but there was a defining moment that uh, you know, I'm kind of unraveled with uh, you know, health issues about a year and a half ago. But when I think of, as I reflect and I look back on my experience, uh, I remember, gosh, probably 12, 13, 14 years ago working with uh co-workers and and joking about uh how we needed to stop caring less because work was getting so stressful. We felt like if we just stopped caring so much about protecting others, about taking care of um others and and uh bringing impact to the work and and making sure that it felt purposeful, then we could go home at the end of the day and leave work at work. I mean, that was just kind of a joke. I never did anything to really explore what that might look like or why we were all kind of saying the same thing. It it really in the last few years, I would say my journey started probably around the time of the pandemic. I think the pandemic certainly exacerbated things, but it wasn't the defining, it wasn't it wasn't the only thing that caused my feelings of of going into burnout. Uh, but the pandemic really brought uh more uh pressure on working and that always on culture that we many of us feel, especially as high achievers. And now I was at home and I was having to parent and lead a large team, and there was no boundaries between work and life, home life and parenting and and you know, taking care of my five-year-old at the time. Uh, and but then over the course of the pandemic, something really beautiful happened, and I was able to find those boundaries, and then I was able to even find joy in the flexibility of working from home and and being able to uh to you know throw a lot of load of laundry in between meetings and go water some, you know, my flowers in between meetings and not come home with uh you know a pile of work to do at home right after, you know, finishing my heavy work day. And and so once I found those boundaries and and fell in love with that flexibility, that's when that started, they started taking that back away from us, right, by calling us back to the office. Uh and uh I think that was where I started to see that loss of autonomy, loss of control, not feeling like I was a part of the decisions that were being made, leading large teams. I wasn't aligned with what I was being asked to do in terms of bringing really high-performing employees back that needed to now spend, you know, hours in the car commuting and how that would impact young parents and, you know, those that had disabilities, um, you know, not feeling like I could lead from an inclusive and authentic place anymore. I think that's really where I started it started to feel that deeply depleting sense of burnout where you're just kind of jumping from one meeting to the next all online and then coming home. And I had no energy left for my son, he's now 11, to interact with him, to be present with him. Meals were rushed because I had no energy really to pull meals together and think about what that looked like. I'm a single parent. Um, so no backup for that. And so I wasn't showing up for the things that truly mattered for me anymore. Uh, and and and and ended up taking a four-month leave of absence after I woke up with a face full of shingles and was worried that I would lose my eyesight. Uh, and and and realized that pushing through, pushing through the stress was not gonna serve me anymore. And my body was forcing me to take a break that I needed. So I took four months off, and that's really where I started realizing how much of my identity was wrapped up in my title and my busy schedule because I had no idea what to do with myself. I had never taken a break like that before. Uh, and and it felt really uncomfortable. And so it forced me to reckon with myself who am I outside of work? Who am I if I'm not if my identity is not attached to my title? Uh, I did end up going back to my job for a couple months and I didn't start falling right back into my old ways of working. What I did was I realized that the things that were being asked of me, I was not okay with. I was not aligned with what, you know, what the asks were. I wasn't aligned with some of the AI narratives that um were kind of being dictated and and pressed upon us. And so I was fortunate enough to be able to take a stock vest and invest in in building my own practice. Um, so that is where I am now.

Exactly. And it's really a lot of things to learn from, I would say. And here I would also love to bring one part is like um there's a belief that so many ambitious people carry is um and and also I have I have held it myself also that tying your identity to your productivity is actually a strength. That it keeps you kind of sharp, it keeps you motivated, that people who don't do this just lack drive or commitment. So my curiosity is Nicole, is like in your experience, um what is the part of that story that sounds true on the surface but uh starts to fall apart the moment life doesn't go according to the plan?

So you're right that uh people that tie their worth or their identity to their work tend to be more of those higher performers, right? Uh because they find initially they find joy in uh receiving the recognition because they are performing, maybe they're always on, they're always available, and they like the way that recognition feels. Maybe they're getting promoted, they're um, you know, they're seeing that career trajectory uh lay out in front of them and they're moving, they're moving up that ladder. Uh, unfortunately, work is not, we we're not in a place of certainty right now. Very high performing people, high achievers are being laid off. The and and so it's it's forcing a reckoning um with whether we want to really tie our worth to what we produce at work. And if it's if it's tied to what we are producing, are we actually producing work that feels meaningful to us? It's really forcing that this reckoning. We've been conditioned for so long to uh to tie that to you know, our identity to what we're doing that we didn't even realize that that happened. Right. And so uh now I I really feel like I don't know if it's the bubble that I'm in uh and the people that I'm working with, but people are questioning what their identity really means. Well, what why why are they here? Are they actually leveraging their unique gifts and talents in a way that allows them to build the life that uh is meaningful for them? And your worth is inherent, it is not tied to what you produce. You are born with worth. Uh, it's it's a matter of believing that. And then once you do start to believe that, how does that unlock new decisions? There is no one right way to live, right? Even though that's been kind of conditioned and trained into us, there is no one right way. And so if you start to believe in yourself, what cannot unlock um for you in terms of your journey and and your unique path?

Exactly. I I agree, I understand. And when someone is in kind of uh very high stake or high-performing environment, and uh uh uh I mean here's this refrain that their drive might also be their wound. So what comes for them, like relief, resistance, or something else.

Yeah, I think you can be really exceptional at your job um and find meaning in it and still be completely disconnected from yourself, right? I think this goes back to like your condition, the conditioning that we've received. We're told that if we're getting praise and uh recognition uh and we're performing a job well, that that is what we were meant, we are put on this earth to do. What and and very few people actually say, but what are my what are my values and what is the life that I actually want to live? And is this job serving that purpose? And so what I'm seeing now in the people that I'm working with and in myself is it's a complete reworking of what life can look like. It feels like you might be some people might see this as risking um or or um sacrificing things, but I really feel it's uh more of an abundance once people feel like they're truly aligning the work that they're doing, the way that they're working with who they are as a person and the values that they want to display in the world.

I'd love to ask I I know like how listeners are quietly hoping for is not a five-step formula because that's that's not what uh this work is, and but something real. So, what does the shift actually look like from someone who's beginning to question this pattern? Yeah, and maybe like what would be the first honest thing someone can do or ask themselves?

Yeah, you're right. It is a it's uh a unique path for everyone. But if I were to kind of bucket things, you're you need to start by noticing what you're carrying because um a lot of us are holding things that we don't even realize. So that could be, you know, expectations or roles or pressure or identities that were built that you built, or maybe they were given to you, or you inherited them. Um, and the first step is to look at how you're spending your days and what roles you're leaning into and playing that maybe aren't serving you anymore, or maybe they never served you. Uh, and I I think in order to do that, you have to get crisp about what matters to you most, uh, so that you can align how those roles actually map back to those. And then it takes work to figure out what you're going to release. Uh, and this is, you know, this is where that I, you know, that loss of identity might come up. Uh, for me, it was I'm not that corporate leader anymore. And now who am I without that? So dropping that role and those titles, well, who am I now without that? And so figuring out what you want to release and how you want to, how you're gonna hold yourself accountable to releasing and not falling back into those patterns of picking up roles and responsibilities that are not serving you uh in the way that you desire. So identifying what's outdated and inherited and and what's unsustainable. And I think we're all, you know, the burnout epidemic that we're seeing is because we've taken on so much that we are not living healthy lives that are sustainable, right? Um, and you need to be able to let these go without feeling guilt or having feeling this need to kind of overcorrect. Just because you drop something doesn't mean you need to pick something up either. When you start dropping things that aren't serving you, they're not aligning to the person that you want to be in the life that you want to build, that gives you the capacity to show up for the things that actually matter most to you. It does not give you the capacity to pick up things and more things, right? Uh, if that may not serve you. So this kind of starts to give you the framework when you know who you are to align, you know, be very intentional about how you're making decisions and how those align to your core values. Because then you start rebuilding what actually matters to you. So you're letting go uh and you're creating space. From there, you choose what's worth holding through your values and your capacity and your way of operating that supports the life that you want to live.

True. Very true. Cool, and um I mean uh like here here's uh this part also like no one talks about enough. Um this work is not so linear. I mean, someone might have a generally profound moment of clarity and uh they feel like something has shifted, and then uh three weeks later find themselves right back to those old patterns again, random, measuring, right? So what tends to pull people back?

I mean, uh that's like your narrow pathways, right? You have spent years and maybe decades building up those pathways. So to just start doing things differently and showing up different in a different way is not an easy path. It has to be, there has to be an intention behind it. So once you get really crisp again on your values and clear on the vision for yourself and the life that you want to live, you can't just set it and forget it, right? Now you have to keep coming back to that a lot more regularly in the beginning, so that you can rebuild like your default mode. Uh, you know, I'm in a year and a half into kind of rebuilding my identity and I have to still keep checking in with myself, albeit less, right? Now I, you know, where I used to have kind of a four schedule every day, uh, working out first thing in the morning. Now I wake up and I kind of check in with myself. I do my journaling and I check in to see is what I need in that day. And sometimes that's dropping things because I am feeling fatigued. Sometimes that's taking on or moving through, you know, the the tasks or the outcomes that I want to drive. And I'm feeling energized and I can take on even more because I what I've kind of contributed feels I'm I'm energized by it, right? I'm feeling motivated. Um, but setting a firm and disciplined structure without actually checking in whether that's leveraging your energy and your capacity in the best way is not, it's it's going to that that over time is going to deplete you, right? So I'm not a fan of the influence culture. I am an early morning person. I love being up in the morning. Uh, I am also in bed very early. I, but that works for me, right? Uh, I think we have we've kind of gotten to the point where so many people are outsourcing their decision making because they see an influencer online that they think that they want to be like, right? So they're they're listening to this influencer with their, you know, their checklist of this is how you need to spend your day to get the most out of your day and to be successful like me. Um, but you don't really know what's behind the scenes. No one, you know, people on social media uh aren't actually showing the hard stuff. Uh, they're not showing the process that they went through to get there. They're selling you on what works for them. Please do not think that that will work for you. It really is unique and you don't need to apologize for that. Discovering what works best for you uh is it's such a liberating um moment, right, when you figure that out. Uh, when you figure out where your energy is going and what you're saying no to, and you know that it's it's deeply rooted in who you are and your realities, and you're not outsourcing, you're not looking at others to tell you what to do, it empowers you to make the best decisions for yourself and to feel good about those decisions and to feel confident about what you know your next steps.

Right. And uh if suppose uh someone wants to connect with you, how they can connect.

Yeah, so my uh dropmore holdless.com is my website. Uh, I am also on, I do a lot of writing um and offers on Substack. Also dropmore holdless. You'll find me there. I write about all of these topics on my website if you are interested. I offer free uh 50-minute energy audits, and that tends to be a really good place if you're feeling like something's off, but you don't really know where to start. I can help by looking at how you're spending your day and give you some tips on how you can uh maybe begin to let some things go or weave in things that will help uh leverage your positive energy. Um yeah.

Got it. Got it. Yeah. Great. And um, so dear listeners, what I'll do is I'll put all the links and the details into the show notes for your easy reference. And uh I hope something in this conversation gave you just a little more permission to be a person, uh, not just a performer. And if this landed, we share it with someone who needs to hear it because um that's the much important. So leave us a review and come back next week because we are not done having this conversation. So uh with this hope, this is your host of week and this is Helly Man Healthy Life. Take care of yourselves and all the parts of your work. Thank you so much.

Thank you.