Naming The In Between

SPEAKER_01 0:00

There is a place that a lot of women know intimately but rarely have a name for. It is no doubt exactly. It is not faith exactly. It is the in-between. That season where the old certainties don't quite fit anymore, but the new ones haven't arrived yet. It can feel like being spiritually unmoved even when you still believe. And today we are going to sit in that uncomfortable, honest, and ultimately very sacred space.

Meet Brianna Bass

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Welcome back to Healthy Mind Healthy Life, the show where we have real conversations about what it means to take care of the whole person, mind, heart, and spirit. I'm your host, Yosurf, and today I'm joined by Brianna Bass, a certified professional coach, author of Christian Fiction for Women, and the founder of Proverbs and Fears. With 15 years of youth ministry experience and a deep commitment to walking alongside women as they navigate their faith. Today, you're talking about something Brianna calls the in-between. Those seasons on a faith journey where everything feels uncertain and what it actually means to stay whole through them. Brianna, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

Hi, thanks so much for having me.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Perfect.

Burnout And A Shaken Faith

SPEAKER_01 1:42

So Brianna, before we get into the broader conversations, I want to start somewhere personal. Was there a season in your own life where you found yourself in that in-between space, a time when your faith felt more like a question than an answer?

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Yes. It actually, I think, happens for a lot of us a couple of times. It's it's not a one-time or one-season event. It can happen multiple times throughout your journey, throughout your life. For me personally, there was a time right after college where I was in between churches and not really actively involved in my faith. I wasn't always going to worship on Sunday mornings. I wasn't involved with other Christians in, say, Bible studies or anything like that. I think that's fairly typical for a lot of us in our 20s. That's the age where we're just trying to figure out who we are and get our careers started. Uh, maybe romantic relationships. A lot of people will get married and start families at that time. So it's just, I think, to be expected at that age. Um, I then found my way back into my home congregation, and uh that's where I became extremely active with our youth program in particular. Uh, but then it happened again, this time much larger, much bigger than the first. And that was back in 2022. Um, at that time, I worked for an online university, which was fantastic. I got to work from home long before the pandemic hit and we were all in lockdown. Um, but as many of us know, COVID changed things. A lot of people were at home and thinking about, you know, now's a great time to take uh university classes online, which was great for the university. Uh, we had an increase in our student population, but it also increased our workload. And within a couple of years, I was experiencing severe burnout. That then ripple affected into other areas of my life, not just my career, but also into my faith, um, into my personal relationships. Uh, burnout is one of those things that I don't think we really had a name for until a few years ago, uh, but is something that many people over the generations have experienced. And it affects your mind, it affects your spirit, it affects your body in ways that you don't always anticipate. And so I was in the midst of this extreme burnout. Um, I wasn't exercising like I should. I wasn't eating right like I should. Um, I wasn't reaching out to my friends and hanging out with my friends the way that I had used to. Um, I was sort of self-isolating in very unhealthy ways. The only things I was really doing, I was working and I was still active in the church. I had several roles that I participated in at the church, youth advisor, I was on the church board, I was chair of our Christian education committee. And when you have responsibilities, uh, at least for me, there's this intrinsic, well, I have to go and fulfill those responsibilities regardless of how I'm personally feeling in the moment. Uh, because I feel like I owe it to the people that, you know, I'm shepherding, that I'm helping. And uh that wore me out as well, on top of just the general burnout. I was burning the candle at both ends, really. And that led to several moments of uh, you know, me on my knees asking God, what do I do? I don't know how to get out of this dark place. I don't know what the answer is. Um, and I don't know what the next move is. Um, realized pretty quickly I needed to make a career change. That was the biggest thing. And then by 2023, um, I was actively setting up my business and changing to becoming a full-time author and leaving higher education uh behind. But there was still this wrestling with where am I at spiritually and not always feeling like I had the connection with my faith that I had previously experienced. Um I think there was a lot of social media influence happening where there's sort of within Christian culture, this Christian aesthetic that we see online, that everything has to be very perfect. You know, your your Bible has to be perfectly highlighted, you have to have this beautiful space Bible study, that sort of thing. And you start to doubt, you start to wonder, am I am I doing it right? Am I doing enough? So and so all those doubts started coming in as well. Um and and thankfully I'm not in that spot anymore. Um, over the past couple of years, I've been able to lean on my faith and move out of that season and into a stronger relationship with the Lord. But it was a scary season at times, um, a lot of uncertainty about not just what my future looked like, which anybody, regardless of if you're a spiritual person or not, we all have some questions about what the future holds. Um, but also again, just where was my faith and my relationship with the Lord? Was I doing enough? Was I making mistakes? Um, was I worthy? Was I still lovable? Um, and I think those are questions and doubts that many of us wrestle with.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

Yeah. Brianna, when you think about what pulls a woman into an in-between season in the first place, what are the deeper

What Pulls Women Into Doubt

SPEAKER_01 7:56

patterns you tend to see? Is it a specific kind of life event or is it something that builds more slowly underneath the surface?

SPEAKER_00 8:06

It can be both. Um, it can be a specific life event, such as church hurt. Uh, I know that's a term that we use quite frequently these days. Again, something new that we've coined in the past few years, where um particularly for women, you don't feel welcome or you don't feel safe at church. And typically there is one event that has occurred. Um, it could be that um something was said from the pulpit that made you feel inferior, that had you questioning your worth, uh, particularly when it comes to the question of women preaching, for example, um, or just a woman's role within leadership in the church in general. It could also be um assault within the church. That's something that we hear about frequently, um, particularly with male leadership who are making some poor choices when it comes to the women that they're shepherding or the women that they're supervising. That's something that we also have heard a lot about, particularly in recent years. Again, it could just be a single event in those instances. And then for some women, it is where it come happens over time. Um, again, going back to the social media influences, right? There's so many messages, both from secular society as well as Christian culture, that are just bombarding you. Um, and it's hard enough being a woman these days with all the messages about, you know, diets and your appearance and all of that. But then to add to it, again, that perfect Christian aesthetic that you're seeing on social media, um, questions about theology, uh, questions about your worth and your value as a woman within God's kingdom, that can add up. Um, and that one can really sneak up on you as well. You know, when a particular event happens, you're a little bit more aware of it in that moment. But the one that builds, that one can be uh a little bit sneaky. And but equally both of them can have the same uh effect long term as far as really pulling women away from the church, encouraging them to leave faith communities behind entirely.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Yeah. And you know, that's a s that's such an important distinction that a season of spiritual questioning is not a sign that something has gone wrong, but often a sign that something is actually growing, and it and yet living inside it is really comfortable. And that brings me to something for a woman listening right now who is in that in-between, maybe she's been faithful for years and something has shifted, or she's walking away from something and has not found what is next.

How The In Between Feels

SPEAKER_01 11:13

So, what does that actually feel like in the ordinary life, and how can they come out of that?

SPEAKER_00 11:21

That's a great question. As far as the feelings, certainly it can vary. We're all individuals, we have our own feelings, but by and large, it's it's a feeling of hopelessness in some cases. It can be a feeling of just feeling lost. Um, for me personally, when I was last in that season, because there's every possibility that I could be in that season again at some point in the future. I'm not naive enough to say that it won't happen again. But when I was last in that season, it felt cold. It felt like a darkness. Um, there were times when I would sit and try to imagine my future and it was simply a black abyss. Um, and that can be scary. There, there's definitely an element of fear in that, in addition to just the general uncertainty. So I think for a lot of women, it is a feeling of um, it can be a feeling of worthlessness. It can be a feeling of simply not sitting in or not knowing where you fit in. Um I think it's so important for women to recognize and to to hear that you have value. You are worthy of the life that you are living. And God still loves you. No matter what happens within this world, the decisions that you make or the decisions that other people make that affect you, your life is still valid. The other thing to keep in mind is that you can't control other people. You can only control your reactions and your decisions. And you cannot be held responsible for the actions of other people. Oh, and that's tricky sometimes, especially if you're a bit type A and you want to be in control. Um, or if you're the kind of person uh who tends to internalize the guilt and and you tend to blame yourself, it can be it can be di very difficult and tricky to navigate and to recognize that there are some things that outs are outside of your control. And sometimes we just have to learn to let them go and to focus on what we can control.

First Steps To Move Forward

SPEAKER_00 13:46

So, as far as practical tips for that, uh, because I know I've been talking very high level, but as far as practical tips, uh, there's a couple of avenues that I highly recommend. Um, the number one, of course, is talking to someone. That could be talking to a coach, talking to a therapist, uh, talking to a religious leader, uh whether that's you know a pastor, a priest, a rabbi, whomever it is. Um, but even just talking to your friends and family, talking to, I would recommend in most cases, talking to a neutral third party if possible, who can really help look at your situation objectively and doesn't have uh really any stakes in the outcome. But talking to friends and family can sometimes feel a bit more comfortable at somebody that you know and hopefully trust and already feel safe with. But simply talking to someone is always great. And being able to acknowledge that you're in this season, um, that can be very difficult sometimes to say this is what's happening and to articulate, especially in a world where, you know, we kind of idolize perfection and we don't want to uh advertise any kind of doubts or uncertainties or flaws or anything like that, but we have to be able to name it. Um, you cannot move forward until you've named it. So you want to name it, you want to articulate it, and you want to talk to someone. Um, another great tip is journaling. Simply writing it down uh can be really beneficial. And you don't have to keep the journal. You could write the page down and throw it away or put it in the fireplace, whatever the case may be, um, if it's something that you simply don't want lying around. Um, or it's something you could write and you could keep to uh look back on and reflect on. Uh it doesn't have to necessarily be a diary, but if you wanted to date it, you certainly could. Um, but simply being able to write down, you know, what's going on, how you're feeling, um, because that also can be helpful when you do talk to someone. Uh for some of us, I know we are better writers than we are speakers. And so that can give you uh sort of the foundation that you need to then lead into that conversation. Um another one that I really love is uh just a creative outlet. Um, art therapy is really great. And again, different people are going to operate differently, right? Our brains work differently. And so you may want to paint or work with clay or whatever that creative outlet may be, that can also be a way of expressing where you're sitting in that moment and then be able to better articulate that. Uh, so those would be the top practical ways that I would suggest to be able to take that first step. Now, everybody's journey is going to be different, everybody's timeline is going to be different after you've taken that first step. Uh, but just to get to that first step, really allowing yourself to sit in the discomfort, but finding an outlet for it as well. So journaling is really great. Uh, it's a very practical way to put out your emotions, your thoughts, whatever may be rattling around inside your brain and your heart and your soul. Um, and especially for those who may be more comfortable writing than speaking, it's a good way to get all of that out. Um, and then also just art in general is a really great way to express what's inside of you in a way that might feel more comfortable than simply outright stating how you feel. Or if you're someone who has difficulty identifying your emotions and being able to name them, um, again, art can be a really great way to express those feelings as well. Um, and you could always take that to a therapist, for example, or a coach or again a faith leader for interpretation and to help really put words to what it is that you're feeling.

How To Connect And Final Words

SPEAKER_01 18:09

Brianna any way that our listeners can connect with you.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

Yeah, so the best way uh to connect with me is through my website, and that's authorbriannabass.com.

SPEAKER_01 18:25

Perfect. And to everyone listening, all these links are in the show notes, so just go and check those out. Brianna, is there any last message that you want to leave us with?

SPEAKER_00 18:36

I think the biggest thing I want to say uh is just to any woman listening, you are not alone. And being in these seasons is not atypical, it's a part of life to wrestle with doubts, to wrestle with uh uh uncertainty. It's part of your journey, and that's beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 19:04

Wow. Thank you so much, Brianna, for this conversation because it touched something very real, and I know it is going to reach the woman who needed it most today.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

Perfect. Thank you so much for having me, Yusuf.

SPEAKER_01 19:23

It was a pleasure. And to everyone listening, if you are in that in-between right now, if you felt seen by something in this episode, I hope you carry that with you. You are not lost, you are not in the middle of something, and that is not the same thing. This is Healthy Mind, Healthy Light. We'll be back with more conversations that meet you where you are. Until next time, be gentle with yourself.