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Welcome

A Careful Conversation Begins

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back to Healthy Mind, Healthy Life, the space where we have the conversations that quietly matter. I am Archita and today I am joined by Rene Kalun, a licensed therapist whose work centers on supporting survivors and helping the rest of us understand what trauma, recovery, and dignity really look like. In this conversation, we are going to talk, walk into a topic that often gets sensationalized or avoided altogether: human trafficking. And we are going to do it the way our listeners deserve, with care, with clarity, and without flinching. So, Rene, welcome to the show and it's such a pleasure to host you today. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thank you for being here. And we'll start the conversation. But before we start, there is a gentle disclaimer to our listeners. Some statements reflect personal belief and experiences and are presented as individual views, not medical advice. So listeners should consult qualified professionals for medical conditions. And now that we have this out of the way without wasting any more time, let's dive into the conversation. And Rene, first of all, thank you so much for being here. And before we step into the heart of this conversation, I want to start gently. So what was the moment or maybe the reason when this work first started calling you? When you realized that this was something you had to give your time and attention to?

How A Therapist Recognised Trafficking

SPEAKER_01 1:40

Great question. I was a marriage and family therapist working in substance abuse, specifically in an outpatient setting. And I was sitting with women and men who were describing situations that they would say were sexual abuse, domestic violence, or um that they were doing what they had to do in order to survive during their drug addiction. And they were describing situations that I later learned were actually considered human trafficking. And so when I went to a presentation and heard about exactly what human trafficking was and the overlap between that and substance abuse, a light bulb went off.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

Yeah, I think that's that's uh really sensitive. But I'm really glad that you um got into it and now you're helping so many uh survivors out there. I think we need more and more people like you to do this kind of work. And um what you just said, uh that brings me to another point.

The Myth Of Distant Trafficking

SPEAKER_00 2:56

So, Renee, when most people hear the words human trafficking, a very specific image comes to their mind, usually something dramatic, something far away, something they've seen in a movie, maybe. But I have a feeling that image is doing real harm. So, what is a misconception about trafficking that you wish more people, especially everyday listeners, would let go of?

SPEAKER_01 3:20

Yeah, you that is exactly what I thought as well. I thought human trafficking was moving bodies, and the vision that came to my mind was like a white moving truck filled with people. And certainly that is, and that can be part of trafficking, but specifically sex trafficking is happening everywhere. It is in your backyard, it is in your schools, it's in your, it can be very much in your home on completely under your nose, and you have no idea because of social media and the way that children have access to contacting strangers and strangers contacting your children. It can be sitting on the couch right next to you and and you don't know. And that's this, I think the scariest part for parents. And sometimes it can feel so overwhelming that it's much easier to say, Oh, that's not happening, than it is to turn and say, What can I do about it? Or how can I protect my child or my loved one?

SPEAKER_00 4:22

Absolutely, and it's really important uh to expose this part of um trafficking to the listeners as well, because so less of us are uh aware of uh what actually happens in this process. So I'm really glad that you brought that up and that reframing matters so much, Renee, because the moment we picture trafficking as something distant and cinematic, we stop noticing the quieter and more ordinary ways it actually shows up, like you just explained. Now, uh let's stay with that for a moment because I think the deeper layer is even more important. So, Rene,

Vulnerability And The Slow Grooming Build

SPEAKER_00 5:01

a lot of people imagine that trafficking happens uh because of one big obvious moment of force. But from your work with survivors, I'm guessing the reality is much more layered. So, what are some of the deeper patterns underneath uh, you know, the vulnerabilities, the slow buildups, the conditions that make someone um targetable in the first place?

SPEAKER_01 5:24

Great, great question. So, what you're describing is can still absolutely happen. You know, someone can be kidnapped and and forced into sex slavery or trafficking, labor trafficking, etc. But what we're seeing more and more, and why I can say that it's happening on the couch sitting, you know, while your child sitting next to you, is because pimps are able to connect with the vulnerable population, children in foster care, children in the criminal justice system, children who don't feel good about themselves, kids with self-confidence issues. Pretty much every adolescent is going through a phase in their life where they're trying to figure out who they are, um, who their friend group is, et cetera. And so pimps are able to prey onto that population and they talk to these kids. It doesn't just have to be a child either. It can absolutely be an adult. Um, but they're preying on these people and they're finding out their trigger points and they're finding out what they're looking for. Is it, is it an intimate relationship? I don't mean a sexual relationship, but is it an intimate friendship or an intimate uh parent child relationship? Is it a mentor? Is it, you know, do they need food? Do they need clothing? And then they're able to meet that need. And that's how they start grooming them and they start showing how much they care about them, how much they love them, because they're offering them gifts or time or energy or whatever it is. And so these folks get connected to them and bonded to them because they are offering them something that they want and need. And that's how it's a slow build. It's not something quick. And that's what I'm that's what I'm seeing in the rooms. And that's why I think people are confused that how could it be trafficking? Because I'm not in a in a box truck. I'm just at home and I'm just communicating with my boyfriend or a friend or a coach or even a parent.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

Yeah, I think a lot of listeners will be able to recognize that pattern um because that that really happens. That's one of the most common manipulation tactics out there. Um, thank you for bringing that up, Renee. And that's uh that's such an honest and important answer as well. You're describing trafficking less as a single event and more as something that grows in the cracks of a person's life, which means prevention isn't just about awareness, it's about how we treat the most vulnerable among us every single day. And that's the most important part.

Quiet Signs In Everyday Life

SPEAKER_00 8:08

So, uh Rina, now let's bring this into the everyday life. So, for someone listening, a teacher, a parent, uh, a friend, a co-worker who isn't a clinician and doesn't work in this space, what does this actually look like in real life? Not the dramatic version, but the quiet version.

SPEAKER_01 8:28

You mean how would they recognize it in their regular life? Yes. Got it. So one of the ways is if your friend or loved one is coming home with expensive gifts, kids will come home with new phones or new sneakers, and they don't have an answer of kind of where it came from, or they're saying they're friend. So looking out for new things or spending a lot of time with people who are significantly older than them who are offering them something in exchange for their time. Um, that's kind of as it progresses. But initially it would be new things, a lot of time with someone significantly older. Um the inability to have multiple relationships and really just hyper focused on one specific relationship. You can also look at the mental health of it all and similar symptoms to depression and anxiety can also overlap with being traumatized and victimized. So those are some of the the common things. Um as people are older and in more adult relationships, not being able to leave their partner, being fearful, those would be a different in a different stage of the trafficking um spectrum.

SPEAKER_00 10:06

Yeah, I think you you have given some of the most common um signals out there. So thank you so much for that. But you know what you just said, that brought another question to my mind. Uh

Helping Without Judgement Or Pressure

SPEAKER_00 10:19

if let's say if someone in our life uh shows some of those quieter sides, so what's the difference between being helpful and accidentally making things harder for them?

SPEAKER_01 10:29

How do we differentiate to wanting to trying to intervene and telling them that that is not necessarily a healthy relationship? I think asking them questions rather than providing your opinion is always the way to go. Asking questions like, how does that person make you feel? How do what do you like about them? What do you not like about them? Are you the best version of you when you are around them? Those are all great questions, no matter what the relationship looks like. And it gets people to think about how they're truly showing up in relation to other people and how those other people are showing up in relation to them. So I think those are great questions, no matter how old your child is or your partner, just to get them to critically think about who they are bringing into their life. Other questions like do your friends like them? Do they not like them? Why, why not? Um, you know, what again, what are is this person bringing out the best version of you? And are they promoting your individual goals? Have your goals changed? What are they? What's what are the barriers? Being curious about someone's life is and asking those harder questions rather than just saying, like, hey, I don't like your boyfriend because every time he's around, you know, we can't talk about our favorite show because he doesn't like it. That's not helpful information. And it comes across as judgy and it's going to just turn the person off as well as their partner.

SPEAKER_00 12:13

Absolutely. And that makes so much sense now. And that distinction is everything. Most people genuinely want to help, but they don't know how to do it without making the person feel cornered or exposed. So what you just shared gives listeners a way to be present without being intrusive. And that's such a gift. So thank you so much for that, Renee. And um now move please go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

Oh, I just said absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 12:41

Yeah.

Trauma Informed Support And Practical Tools

SPEAKER_00 12:42

So uh Renee, moving on for survivors who are walking the long road of healing, and for the people who love them, what's a practical or reflective approach you keep coming back to in your work? Something simple, something rooted, or something a listener could hold on to tonight.

SPEAKER_01 13:00

Something that that person or the family could do. Is that what you're asking? Yes. So as someone is realizing that they may be in a relationship like this or in a situation that they are being trafficked, absolutely partnering with a trauma-informed team, including a physician, a therapist, etc. Like I said, I was practicing in therapy for over a decade before I understood what trafficking was and is. And there are still a lot of clinicians who don't understand. So finding someone who speaks your language and who's non-judgmental and who's going to approach it in a trauma lens is of utmost importance and who's not going to shame you, and also can understand the difference between survival sex, trafficking, domestic violence, sexual abuse. They're all very different and nuanced. So I would say do that. Um people can use the human trafficking hotline to report anything that they find suspicious. There is also an app that you can, if you go on vacation, especially as we come into the summer months, you can take pictures of your hotel room and upload them to this app, which is really helpful for law enforcement when they find pictures of people on the internet when they're when pimps are advertising their victims, they can easily identify the hotel rooms based on those pictures. So that's something that you can do today.

SPEAKER_00 14:35

Yes, and this also reminds us that prevention is always better than cure. And honestly, Renee, that's such a tender answer because you're reminding us that healing doesn't always look like progress. Sometimes it looks like a person just learning how to take up space in their own life again. And that's not life, that's everything.

Nonlinear Recovery And Avoiding Burnout

SPEAKER_00 14:56

But um, as we all know, that recovery is rarely linear. There are setbacks, anniversaries, um, hard seasons, days where everything um that felt steady suddenly doesn't. So, Rene, how do you support survivors through those moments? And for listeners who are walking alongside someone they love, what helps them stay the course without burning out?

SPEAKER_01 15:20

I think understanding exactly that you said that recovery is not linear, that it is very messy, and it's it's like a roller coaster and realizing that you've been here before, you'll be here again. We're never inviting in a relapse, but we are always preparing for that. And recovery does not happen in isolation. It is part of the village that you live in, your friends, your family, everyone should be in recovery and everyone should be getting help so that they can stay with you. There's often overlapping either addiction or mental health issues, and making sure that you're following your treatment plans for all of those things is absolutely going to help you in your recovery. And again, having a strong support system who knows, like, hey, this season of life or this event that's coming up or this specific date is going to be hard and you can do hard things is crucial. Not that we're pushing our feelings away, um, but we're again preparing for them to come in and knowing that we can do hard things. We've been here before, I think is really helpful.

SPEAKER_00 16:28

Absolutely. I think that's some great advice. And, you know, that's the kind of permission a lot of supporters don't realize they need. And you've just reminded us that you can love someone deeply and still need your own grand ground to stand on. Both can be true and both have to be true. So thank you so much for all the wisdom that you have brought into this conversation and the meaningful insights that you have shared. I think this has been really informative, Rene. And uh, one last question before we close for today. For the

A Message Of Worth And Where To Connect

SPEAKER_00 17:02

listener who's quietly recognizing themselves in this conversation, maybe for the first time, and who's realizing that what they've been calling their flaws or their bad choices might have been survival all along. So, what do they want them to hear from you tonight?

SPEAKER_01 17:19

That recovery is possible. You are worthwhile, you are brave, you can do hard things, and you can get support, and you deserve support.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

Absolutely. That is something I think a lot of listeners um needed to hear today. So thank you for sharing that. And if if there is something that I would like to take away from this conversation, it's that what looks like a flaw is often a fingerprint of survival. And the moment we learn to read it, everything we thought we knew about people, including ourselves, begins to soften. So, Renee, before we let you go, I'd love for our listeners to be able to find you, follow your work, and continue learning from you beyond this episode. So, where's the best place for them to connect with you?

SPEAKER_01 18:05

Sure. The best place to reach me is through my personal website. It's www.rene calhounlmft.com. And you can also check out the nonprofit agency I work for called Worthwhile, and that's www.worthwhile.org.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

Amazing. Thank you so much for sharing that, Renee. And we will make sure to include all those details in today's show notes so that it's just one click away, and our listeners can reach out to you whenever they need to. And thank you for sitting with us through this conversation. I know there were moments in it that probably touched something quite new. And I hope you don't rush past that. Sit with it, be a little gentler with yourself today, and a little gentler with the people around you. Because the truth is, most of us are walking around carrying more than anyone can say. And the kindest thing we can do is stop assuming we already know the story. Until next time, take care of yourself and take care of each other.